20 May Lucas Gillespie talked about WoW in schools (and you can follow WoW in schools on twitter too). There is information about WoW in schools in this blog post by Liz Danforth, a blog post from WoW insider, and a video with students talking about their experiences. . Explore Lucas's blog about education and games, or follow him on twitter

"Where is the library" has earned the achievement Undead Slayer! -
big thanks to Reyn√¢rdine for this

Franticread (Ellen Forsyth): Hello and welcome to this talk. My name is Ellen Forsyth and I work at the State Library of New South Wales‚

I would like to acknowledge all the traditional owners of the land.

It is great to see all of you here today.

I have been looking forward to hearing from this speaker for a long time

Lucas Gillespie will talk about WoW in schools which is a very exciting project. Some of you would have heard a bit from Peggy about this earlier. We were expecting Peggy Sheehy as well, but she is unable to make it today, but I am sure we will have a great time

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Wow... What an awesome group here! So cool to meet all of you. So, this will be my first presentation fully in the "chat" medium... At least for some time. Kind of makes me nostalgic for the old days of chat-only guild meetings. Anyway... a bit of background and history related to the project.

It was a student who introduced me to MMORPG's...He knew I loved games and fantasy lit. and suggested I try Everquest. I was hooked. It was amazing.

I'd dabbled in text-based virtual spaces before (LambdaMOO and some MUD's)... But nothing like this. Every day, every experience was a "brain buzz."

This student and I used to play the game while reviewing for Physical Science tests. We'd adventure while brushing up on Newton's laws, chemistry, etc.

Before long, a group began to gather in my classroom at break, lunch, before and after school....and an informal club emerged.

These were good kids, but generally didn't fit into other school groups or sports. My room was a safe place to "geek out." And so... I recruited my students to come play with us.

Otherwise: how long ago was this?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): That was around 2001-2002. I continued to play MMO's with students through the years and saw the same things all along.

Around 2008 I left the classroom to take a position as Instructional Tech. Coordinator for my district. (I was wrapping up my Master's in Instructional Tech. that year as well.)

A major portion of my program was Instructional Design and early on I began to make connections between game play in MMO's and Instructional Design principles. So, in Spring of 2009, I wrote down every possible idea I could think of that related to using MMO's, particularly WoW, with students for learning. I shared those with others (like Peggy) and finally decided to put it all in a wiki... So others could easily contribute.

I gathered supporting research and fleshed out some basic logistics for implementation, tested it on the district network with the help of our network guy....and then pitched the idea for an after-school club for at-risk kids to our district Instructional Team of which I am a part.

The response was (paraphrased)... "...we don't really understand it, but you've done your homework, and this sounds good for kids. Let's do it."

So, I used some funding that I had access to, purchased the accounts, playtime cards, and from November of 09 to June of 2010, we ran our after school club. We selected about 15 boys and girls each of whom were considered "at-risk" either officially or simply because they didn't fit in elsewhere. And, the things we saw were awesome. Before long, we had kids running to the media center at the end of the day. And mind you, their play wasn't always "free play."

Otherwise: they paid?

(Lucas Gillespie): No, by that I mean, we didn't simply turn them loose to do as they wished. We structured it. We had writing assignments and projects for them to do...

Grelk: did you set them ingame goals, or did those arise from the mechanics of the game with them discussing later?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Both, Grelk. Sometimes we had goals that arose from basic game mechanics. Such as: level your character to 12 so you can join a guild group (all students) to do Deadmines. or, level your herbalism to share things you make with others.

But we also had activities outside the game, but related... Such as: 1. Describe characteristics of a good guild. 2. Suggest a guild name that embodies those characteristics. 3. Write a speech in the forum to become an officer of the guild.

Grumblin: do you think you had / have more influence on the classroom as an admin, or as a teacher?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Grumblin - Great question. I believe outside. However, that's not to say I couldn't have had similar influence while in the classroom. Perhaps, my opportunities and ability to "see" areas for influence have expanded.

Reyn√¢rdine: did you do anything deeper? Such as "Why do you think guilds break up?" "Do you think it's hard to lead a raid, and why or why not?" group dynamicy flavoured things

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Rey - Well, actually, we're scratching the surface of those sorts of things this year.

Stefwyn (Mylee Joseph): Did the other non-gaming teachers comment on any out of game effects they saw on the students?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Stef - Yes. There were improvements in behavior, attendance, potentially academics, though we didn't do a heavy focus on collecting that data.

Shazzamatazz: did you see any changes in the way the students related to one another - e.g. did it help strengthen (or perhaps change) their realworld relationships?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): So, the school administrator approached me and said, "We need to take this to the next level. How do we do that?" My response: "This needs to be part of the regular school day."

Grumblin: :-) PvP raids obviously

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Ha! (and yes, there has been some significant PvP)

So, Craig Lawson, my go-to teacher at Cape Fear Middle, where this is taking place, and I have set out to create a year-long, 8th-grade, language arts curriculum. And, that's what we've been doing this year.

The class consists of 16 students. Girls and Boys. Multi-racial.

Otherwise: did the kids sign up? or was this compulsory

Grumblin: are they all "gamers"?

Reyn√¢rdine: what's the gender ratio?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): And, spanning the ability range from learning disabled to academically gifted.

@Other - the kids were approached to see if they'd be interested.

Gender ratio... one moment, have to count in my head.

Otherwise: did more boys say yes than girls?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Real, about 5 girls to 11 boys, I believe.

Deybarah: were there any negative aspects, like parents annoyed their kid was spending too much time in a game?

Grelk: so they're developing complementary skills?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Grelk - So, yes, all of the curriculum that's being developed is being done in Moodle.

Reyn√¢rdine: you guys use Mahara for portfolios?

Grelk: good platform

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Grelk - And it's aligned to the Common Core standards for 8th grade language arts.

Reyn√¢rdine: OS ftw

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): It's an enrichment course, though we speculate could easily replace a standard language arts course.

Grelk: I can definitely see how "living an adventure" = rich material for writing/language work

Shazzamatazz: esp creative writing

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): So everything we're doing, parallels what they're learning in their regular language arts course.

Reyn√¢rdine: in especial on an rp realm

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Exactly.

Grumblin: I seem to recall some Joseph Campbell injections

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): And so, we're really capitalizing on those aspects.

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Grumblin - Yep. We're loosely basing our theme on the idea of the Hero's Journey.

Grumblin: epic.........journey :-)

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): As they progress through WoW as a Hero, they're reading Tolkien's The Hobbit.

Shazzamatazz: awesome

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): We're drawing parallels about their's and Bilbo's experiences.

Grumblin: not exactly light reading for the grade......

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): And, all of those experiences are compared to real-world experiences. ((Someone asked about parents and play time. Not a problem. We have parental controls on all accounts so they only play at school... (irony?))

Otherwise says: no fun questing alone...

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): We're using their experiences as a foundation for tons of creative writing. They write fiction about their characters. They analyse quests, then write their own. They've written poems and rehearsed them in the streets of Stormwind.

Grumblin: did you find that the students levelled at different rates.... was one student level 60 and one level 20

Reyn√¢rdine: have you branched into the arts or maths?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): We created Twitter accounts and Tweeted from NPC's points-of-view during the Cataclysm pre-release events. Propaganda and ads... etc.

Grelk: does the curriculum have a scope for more formal language" eg analysis of game mechanices (Related to Reynardine's Q)

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): And now they're working on their machinima projects.

Otherwise: awesome

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Grumblin - Yes.

There are a couple among them who're experienced players. They level faster.

@Rey - Not yet, at least in the course (officially)

@Grelk - Yes.

@Grelk - Not all creative writing. Students wrote campaign speeches. They wrote mission statements for the guild.

Shazzamatazz: sounds like a lot concerning identity, personal identity, group identity etc

Grelk: community building

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): We have one project where they choose a character from the Hobbit, conduct online research using WoWWiki, Elitist Jerks, etc., and then write (citing sources) what race/class their chosen character would be if a char. in WoW.

@Shazz - Yes.

Grumblin: that would be fun

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): So, course development is nearly complete. We're making attempts at gamifying the course, too.

No grades. They earn XP.

No assignments. They have quests.

Grumblin: how does that translate into assessment....

Stefwynn (Mylee Joseph): Wouldn't it be lovely if library school had quests instead of assignments!

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): There has been some degree of learner choice, though we hope to increase that next year.

Deybarah: have you ever looked into the non competitive sandbox type 3d worlds, like second life? or is it the achievements and stories in wow that allows it to work so well

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Grumblin - Everything they do and create is an assessment.

Reyn√¢rdine says: I could have sworn storytelling was quest based.

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Dey - The story-driven world of WoW make it idea, I think. Though, I've just started a project with 5th graders using Minecraft.

Grelk: Still in language, or are you looking across to design with that one/

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): I really think we can connect nearly any "good" commercial game to nearly any curriculum. We just have to wear our "teacher glasses" and be open-minded.

@Grelk - Well, we're in a test-phase currently.

Grumblin: im surprised at the lack of "in my day" pushback

Shazzamatazz: there's a lot of room for sociology too in wow

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Next step will be to find a willing teacher(s) to take it on. I can help them connect it to curriculum. I do think, though, that language/writing is always an easy connection.

@Shazz - Totally agree.

Our kids will write. They enjoy it. They're passionate about their game experiences.

Shazzamatazz: my 6 year old and I naturally ended up on a discussion about indigenous cultures when playin Tauren

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Shazz - Yes! We have a lesson on that very topic available on the project wiki designed by another educator who used to work, here, in North Carolina.

Reyn√¢rdine: Are they native?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): It looks at the influence of Native American art on the Tauren story/setting.

@Rey - Nope... At least, I don't think so?

Stefwynn (Mylee Joseph): What level of gaming skill will the teachers need to have to feel comfortable using the lessons?

Grumblin: the students can probably even game without the teacher....teacher just handles the debriefing

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Stef - Low to Moderate. As Diane Lewis says, I'm more concerned in finding a teacher who loves kids. If that's in place, the gaming thing will work itself out.

Grumblin: agreed

Stefwyn (Mylee Joseph): Sometimes people are hesitant to jump into something they're not too familiar with - we see that a bit in public libraries

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): So, we're really excited about the project. Peggy Sheehy is running it at her middle school in New York. Diane Lewis has it running at two schools in Seminole Co., Florida. And, the beauty of this is, that because of the virtual world aspect, all of our kids can be connected and play together.

Grelk: very nice

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Stef - Yeah, I see that.

Shazzamatazz: there seems such a natural place for this approach in primary/secondary school, I wonder how or whether it could be adapted for higher ed

Grumblin: ...no cross town rivalrys?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): I think many educators are curious, but still very cautious about the idea of playing games in class.

@Shazz - There are folks doing it already.

Stefwynn (Mylee Joseph): curious but cautious is ok as long as it doesn't stop them having a go

Otherwise: the games = no good idea must be changed

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Stef - Well said.

Shazzamatazz: can you expand on that? (I'm in higher ed)

Grumblin: I teach game design in higher ed, and even there I get negative feedback about using games in the classroom

Deybarah: i guess its the kind of thing that is not understood by a wider population and may end up in news stories like '/my tax dollar is spent on wow instead of books!' or that could be a fear

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Shazz - I need to track down locations, but, I know of one community college teacher who's using it for creative writing. Another (also community college) is using it for economics, perhaps?

Shazzamatazz: cool :)

Franticread (Ellen Forsyth): and the next speakers in July used it at a university level

Grelk: @deybarah I'd have stats on costings for sports teams to hand myself

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Another instructor I've met is doing similar work with Lord of the Rings Online (nice b/c it's now free)

@Dey - Yeah... Surprisingly, that's where small town has worked nicely.

Maxwelig: LOTR isn't Mac friendly though

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): We've been featured in the local newspaper, but there was little (none actually) in the way of commenting.

@Max - True, sadly.

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): So, we plan to release the Moodle course to anyone who wants it in late June, just before ISTE. And anyone's free to take it, modify it, re-tool it, etc.

So, that's the big picture... What other questions might I answer?

Warriorwolf: will we be able to see it too?

Grumlin: are you posting it to the Mooch feature of Moodle 2.0?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Grumblin - Well, never heard of that, so, I'll have to look into it.

@Warrior - As far as I know.

Grumblin: giant feature in 2.0, a central location for Moodle courses

Shazzamatazz: did you see many/any instances of proactive research/learning amongst the students? in other words to what degree did they start self-directing?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): I'm looking for ways to also post it in a non-LMS format... Maybe one big, fat, PDF.

Warriorwolf: lol what ever works

Grumblin: ...any instances of cyber bullying

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Shazz- Yep. They are very willing to go onto WoWWiki, WoWHead, etc. to research quests, stats, etc.

@Grumblin - No. And that's been fascinating. That kids, who would be the likely target, is also a really good healer (or tank, or...), so you're nice to them.

Grumblin: I was thinking of more external sources.... non guildies / griefers

Otherwise: how do they interact with pugs?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): One of the biggest drawbacks (downsides) to the whole thing....As they move on to their freshmen year in high school, they won't have club like this.

Warriorwolf: :(

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): One parent (of a student who's shown huge social improvements) called our Asst. Superintendent with this concern. It was affirming and heartbreaking at the same time.

Otherwise: they are free to create one though

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Yes, and I will totally support it. Just have to get that school on board.

Grumblin: :-) as the curriculum levels with the students

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Other - (Re: Pugs) - They've interacted well, for the most part. PUG's have really been a mirror for them. They've been quick to criticize players they don't know, but then have to consider their own behavior.

Shazzamatazz: seems to be a common challenge for most gamers :)

Otherwise: a big part of this game is learning to play with others :)

Deybarah: indeed

Grumblin: "how to teach empathy"

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): The Moodle course pushes them to write about those sorts of interactions reflectively.

Shazzamatazz: fantastic!

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Well, we hit on that issue often.

Shazzamatazz: are these reflections visible to other students or a private sort of thing?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): I keep pushing it because of the things I see online... especially with communities like XBox 360.

Grumblin: I'd LOVE to see a character journal built into WoW....

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): (err... XBox Live)

Shazzamatazz: ^

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Shazz - Yes, all visible.

Grumblin: (lucky you didn't do this on the play station network)

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): They're typically threaded discussions but also using the "blog" feature of Moodle.

@Grublin - No kidding! Wow...

Grumblin: I didn't do my homework, the servers were down

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Ha!

So, if any of you think you might like to do a similar project, I'd strongly encourage you to do so. We'd love to have you come play with us.

Grumblin: are there specific data points you're looking to collect this year that you wish you had last year?

Reyn√¢rdine: what servah?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Our goal is to have all students under one guild (The Legacy - a name they chose).

Shazzamatazz: would encourage continuity in relationships maybe network development

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Grumblin - You know, I've been approached by a couple of researchers who wanted to collect data. My initial response was no, because I didn't want the constraints of any formalized study, especially since we were developing much of the course as we were...teaching it. We may, however, be more open to non-obtrusive data collection next year.

Shazzamatazz: I'm mainly interested in anecdotal info like this - awesome program :)

Much appreciation is shown to Lucas.

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Thanks folks! I'm honored.

Franticread (Ellen Forsyth): The next talk takes place 14 or 15 July, depending on your place in the world Landon K Pirius and Gill Creel , co authors of Reflections on play, pedagogy, and World of Warcraft, EDUCAUSE Quarterly, Volume 33, Number 3, 2010, will talk about their experiences in teaching and learning in an online game environment at a university

Shazzamatazz: is all the information you've made available via the wiki? or are there other sources?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): @Shazz - Yep. http://wowinschool.pbworks.com ...and, I can't wait to tell the kids that even more folks, from around the world, are following their work.

Shazzamatazz: totally :)

Grelk: following, and highly approving

Otherwise: which server?

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): And, my blog - http://www.edurealms.com

@Other - Sisters of Elune

Shazzamatazz: awesome thanks

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): Please don't hesitate to contact me with other questions.

Reyn√¢rdine once again wishes that all the Library folks would just be on the same server.

Gylyspy (Lucas Gillespie): (Oh, and on Twitter - @PCSTech